[time-nuts] Making a HP 10811 better
EWKehren at aol.com
EWKehren at aol.com
Sun Mar 28 12:55:09 UTC 2010
Good morning
I have a more fundamental question. Having three 10811-5071 all with Allan
Variance from 1 to 100 Hz well below 1 E-12 one as low as 6 E-13 why would
I want to mess with them at all?
Bert Kehren
In a message dated 3/28/2010 8:32:12 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
lists at rtty.us writes:
Hi
If your zero g axis only works over a 1/100 G range, you are looking at
something other than acceleration. If you have found an axis with a zero, it
should be a just as much a null at 1 mG as at 1 G as at 10 G's. It's also
possible that your "zero" is actually a minimum below your test resolution
and higher G's bring it up to the point you can measure it. There's no
guarantee of a zero being there.
Hitting the oscillator makes it vibrate in all three axis, that's not
going to be suppressed regardless of which way you have it mounted.
Bob
On Mar 28, 2010, at 12:42 AM, WarrenS wrote:
>
> Humm,
> Have to admit, I did not consider that as a possibility before.
> Maybe when I tap on it, its not microphonics after all that cause the
freq to modulate, but the vibration of the inside stuff that is warming it up.
> For every action there is a reaction and for every nut there is a
wing-it-nut.
>
> ws
> *****************
> Hi
>
> If that's the result you are getting, you are measuring something other
than G sensitivity. Temperature effects possibly.
>
> Bob
>
> ****************
> On Mar 27, 2010, at 11:02 PM, WarrenS wrote:
>
>>
>> Just a friendly comment about the Zero G turn over point and Vibration
>>
>> Like Zero temp turn over, Special orientation of the OSC ONLY works
good over a VERY SMALL range, (maybe a 1/100 of G change)
>> It would not help vibration and has no effect on microphonics which are
likely a bigger problem anyway.
>> Try taping you Osc, It's freq will go crazy if monitoring it at high
resolutions and bandwidths
>>
>> ws
>>
>> ************************
>>
>> Hi
>>
>> The concrete basement floor is your friend.
>>
>> Stay as far away from the blower on the furnace as you can. If you have
a drop forge in the basement avoid it as well :)....
>>
>> You will indeed have a seismograph, but not a very useful one. There's
not a lot of G's at seismic frequencies unless you live in an active
earthquake region. The fundamentals of G's and displacement vs frequency are in
your favor in that respect.
>>
>> Bob
>>
>>
>> On Mar 27, 2010, at 12:42 PM, Stanley Reynolds wrote:
>>
>>> Is the source of the vibration important ? I'm thinking that any
vibration that is not on the same axis as gravity. Walking across the lab vs a
fan that is out of balance close by. Would a suspended mass mounting help
with vibration isolation and damping with rubber pads and springs or would
that just make a seismograph ?
>>>
>>> Stanley
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----
>>> From: Peter Vince <pvince at theiet.org>
>>> To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement <time-nuts at
febo.com>
>>> Sent: Sat, March 27, 2010 10:51:07 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Making a HP 10811 better
>>>
>>> Warren,
>>>
>>> If you turn over an oscillator, is the frequency change
>>> completely reversible (to your "under 1e-12 resolution") when it is
>>> restored? Thinking aloud, if an hour-glass is turned over twice, the
>>> final level will be the same, but the grains will be mixed. A quartz
>>> crystal, however, is solid, so hopefully nothing actually moves.
>>> Presumably the zero-G axis is with the axis of oscillation at 90
>>> degrees to gravity?
>>>
>>> Peter (the "other" one :-)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> Another thing I use it for is to test high resolution Freq meters.
>>>> Using a calibrated wedge that I can then slide under one edge of the
zero-G
>>>> Osc box, I can
>>>> make small, variable, repeatable, freq changes of under 1e-12
resolution,
>>>> something pretty hard to do otherwise.
>>>> If I want to make BIG changes like 1e-10, I can rotate the box on any
of its
>>>> sides and still use the wedge,
>>>> and for a quick check of new equipment, I just turn the box over
which then
>>>> gives a couple of parts in 1e-9 freq change.
>>>> It makes a weird but simple and indispensable variable freq source
that is
>>>> useful for many things, such as checking the LOOP TC of a TBolt.
>
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