[time-nuts] B.V.A. 8600 for sale

SAIDJACK at aol.com SAIDJACK at aol.com
Thu Aug 29 15:03:57 EDT 2013


Here is my experience with trying to get one of these for very low noise  
ADEV measurements:
 
* waited for some years for one to pop up on Ebay/Time-Nuts/Craigslist etc. 
 I even sent a couple of BVA WANTED emails to time-nuts in the past, no 
response  from anyone.
 
* called the factory, they quoted >$10K prices if I remember correctly,  
out of my budget.
 
* emailed some known "BVA owners" and asked if they wanted to part with  
one. No.
 
* asked the factory for demo units, used units, etc. None available.
 
* based on an old email, found one used for similar price, bought it, and  
happy now
 
I agree, it's much cheaper to get a ULN oscillator from Wenzel for phase  
noise measurements. Those tend to have not quite as good ADEV though (we have 
a  number of these) and because they drive the crystal with massive power 
they age  like crazy, but they do have very good phase noise.
 
For ADEV measurements, these BVA are great, much better than any Wenzel we  
have. Potentially better to way better than the 10811. Not many 10811 will  
perform in the xE-13 level close-in. 10811 also sometimes suffer from 
crystal  jumps, BVA's don't as far as I know due to the nature of the crystal  
design.
 
If you need great phase noise, simply buy a used Wenzel ULN for a couple of 
 100 $$ and phase-lock it to the BVA. That way you can get excellent phase  
noise, and ADEV at the same time. Likely one would do two measurements 
anyway,  one for phase noise and one for ADEV, that way there is no need to 
phase lock a  Wenzel to a BVA. That's the way we do it here - just use different 
references  for different measurements.
 
Those folks that need these and have large budgets (NIST, etc) probably  
don't care if it costs $300, $3000, or $25K and the factory needs to pay its  
employees and rent so their asking price is justified versus the small 
volume  they sell.
 
For us other folks having a seller offer these at $3000 is a nice  
opportunity - if you happen to want exactly this unit. I just wish the seller  would 
rent a Rhode and Schwarz, Symmetricom or other ADEV/PN meter for a  week 
and specify the performance of these units.
 
Bye,
Said
 
 
 
 
In a message dated 8/29/2013 10:21:52 Pacific Daylight Time,  
actast at hotmail.com writes:

I could  be wrong but I thought when I priced these for work the BVA 8600 
AT cut was  substantially cheaper then that. I think the $11,000 is more in 
line with a  BVA 8607 SC cut with an option. But from my point of view the 
close in Phase  Noise on this particular oscillator is what dictates it's 
value. These BVA  8600's typically range from 110 to better then 120 dB @ 1Hz 
which is a big  difference. If this BVA is at the low phase noise end of the 
range it could be  a real bargain at $3000. 
Another option in the $3000 range is the Wenzel  Blue Top ULPN oscillators. 
It may not match a good BVA inside 1Hz but will  have at least a 20dB 
better noise floor from about 10KHz out. The other plus  with a BVA is the the 
Quartz is capacitive coupled where most other  oscillators have metal 
deposited directly on the Quartz which will interact  over time and potentially 
diminish performance. As Tom and other explained  prices go up exponentially for 
ULPN oscillators.
Thomas  Knox



> Date: Thu, 29 Aug 2013 12:53:47 -0400
> From:  paulswedb at gmail.com
> To: time-nuts at febo.com
> Subject: Re:  [time-nuts] B.V.A. 8600 for sale
> 
> OK but like a new car the  value drops 50% off the lot.
> Anyway you slice it as nice as this might  be I will stick with the $100 
and
> less 10544/1081s 105s and sulzers. I  may be a time-nut. But I am not
> time-Nutz.
> Perhaps for the lab  that need it that is a darned good price.
> Regards
> Paul
>  WB8TSL/1
> 
> 
> On Thu, Aug 29, 2013 at 11:39 AM, Said  Jackson <saidjack at aol.com> wrote:
> 
> > Yup, I heard  price goes up from there...
> >
> > Sent From iPhone
>  >
> > On Aug 29, 2013, at 8:37, "Poul-Henning Kamp"  <phk at phk.freebsd.dk> 
wrote:
> >
> > > In message  <572A741B-0213-4F1C-BA59-C2D396A031EC at aol.com>, Said 
Jackson
>  > writes:
> > >
> > >> These are about $11,000  or so new if I am not mistaken.
> > >
> > > Depends  what options it has...
> > >
> > > --
> >  > Poul-Henning Kamp       | UNIX since Zilog Zeus  3.20
> > > phk at FreeBSD.ORG         |  TCP/IP since RFC 956
> > > FreeBSD committer     | BSD since 4.3-tahoe
> > > Never attribute to malice  what can adequately be explained by
> > incompetence.
> >  _______________________________________________
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