[time-nuts] WWVB & Eclipse

Fri Jul 14 16:11:19 EDT 2017

Hi

> On Jul 13, 2017, at 11:06 PM, William H. Fite <omniryx at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Did I put my foot in it? It was a sincere question.

No I don’t think you did. If I implied otherwise, I’m sorry for the imprecision 
of what I wrote. I’m not at all sure of what one would see. I’m only guessing
that the result will be observable. 

Bob

> 
> 
> On Thursday, July 13, 2017, Bob kb8tq <kb8tq at n1k.org> wrote:
> 
>> Hi
>> 
>> I think we are both taking it as a given that the eclipse’s impact on the
>> ionosphere will
>> be “visible” even with a fairly simple setup. I guess that might qualify
>> for a very loose
>> definition of the term “hypothesis” in my case. I can’t speak for Tom.
>> 
>> Bob
>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2017, at 6:24 PM, William H. Fite <omniryx at gmail.com
>> <javascript:;>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Tom, are some specific hypotheses being tested or is this purely
>>> exploratory?
>>> 
>>> Bill
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Thursday, July 13, 2017, Tom Van Baak <tvb at leapsecond.com
>> <javascript:;>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> The trick is to just run the timing receiver in all-in-view mode
>>>> collecting 1PPS data against your house standard as usual, but also
>> capture
>>>> all the binary message(s) where the per-SV Az/El/SNR and phase residuals
>>>> are reported. This allows you to re-create the individual "1PPS" from
>> each
>>>> SV used in the timing solution. Or maybe just use the RINEX data. This
>> is
>>>> what I was referring to in the CORS reference to Brooke.
>>>> 
>>>> It would be "cheating" to know the eclipse path ahead of time and mine
>> the
>>>> data for confirmation. Instead I dare you to blindly mine the GPS data
>> for
>>>> all of August and then make a bold claim when and where the eclipse was,
>>>> like capturing a trace through a cloud chamber. Having done all that you
>>>> can "look in the back of the book" for the actual eclipse path to see
>> how
>>>> right you were.
>>>> 
>>>> /tvb
>>>> 
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Bob kb8tq" <kb8tq at n1k.org <javascript:;> <javascript:;>>
>>>> To: "Tom Van Baak" <tvb at leapsecond.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;>>;
>> "Discussion of
>>>> precise time and frequency measurement" <time-nuts at febo.com
>> <javascript:;> <javascript:;>
>>>>> 
>>>> Sent: Thursday, July 13, 2017 3:01 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] WWVB & Eclipse
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Hi
>>>> 
>>>> If one perhaps knew the path of the eclipse in advance *and* had a GPS
>>>> timing receiver that
>>>> could be set somehow to look at a single satellite….. all one would need
>>>> is a means of comparing
>>>> the output to a stable reference to *possibly* observe something
>>>> interesting.
>>>> 
>>>> More or less: You know the path of eclipse roaring along bashing the
>>>> ionosphere. You can (maybe)
>>>> pick a sat who’s signal traverses that region while getting to your
>>>> location during the eclipse. Yes, it’s
>>>> not original science. It might still be fun.
>>>> 
>>>> Bob
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On Jul 13, 2017, at 5:55 PM, Tom Van Baak <tvb at LeapSecond.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Brooke,
>>>>> 
>>>>> Nice set of links. Thanks. There's a poster here with an overview:
>>>>> 
>>>>> https://cedarweb.vsp.ucar.edu/wiki/images/6/60/Magdalina_
>>>> Moses-Eclipse_Research_CEDAR_Poster.pdf
>>>>> 
>>>>>> Is there a study based on GPS observations?
>>>>> 
>>>>> It will all be there for free in CORS. It's just a matter of mining the
>>>> data.
>>>>> Apparently this is done a lot. Here are some random examples of what
>> can
>>>> be done. Pretty amazing.
>>>>> 
>>>>> https://www.ngs.noaa.gov/PUBS_LIB/2005_01_ION_NTM_Ionosphere.pdf
>>>>> http://www.gps.gov/cgsic/smg/2004/smith.pdf
>>>>> https://arxiv.org/pdf/1006.3565.pdf
>>>>> 
>>>>> Google for a subset of words like: CORS Ionosphere Monitoring Analysis
>>>> Modeling TEC
>>>>> 
>>>>> /tvb
>>>>> 
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Brooke Clarke" <brooke at pacific.net <javascript:;>
>> <javascript:;>>
>>>>> To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" <
>>>> time-nuts at febo.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;>>
>>>>> Sent: Thursday, July 13, 2017 1:35 PM
>>>>> Subject: [time-nuts] WWVB & Eclipse
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> Hi:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> There's a massive experiment relating to the strength of WWVB and a
>>>> transmitter in Dixon California.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/speaking-of-science/
>>>> wp/2017/07/12/a-massive-atmospheric-experiment-is-
>>>> planned-for-august-solar-eclipse/?utm_term=.4d7101b869f6
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> http://eng.umb.edu/~eclipsemob/index.php <http://eng.umb.edu/%
>>>> 7Eeclipsemob/index.php>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> http://www.hamsci.org/sites/default/files/publications/
>>>> 2017_IES_Liles.pdf
>>>>>> This article says Dixon may transmit at 55.1 and 135.95 kHz.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> The EclipseMob receiver works with a smart phone acting as an SDR. as
>>>> well as the source of it's position and the
>>>>>> date-time of observation.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> There is a parallel study based on ham radio WSPRNet and Reverse
>> Beacon
>>>> Network.
>>>>>> http://hamsci.org/
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Is there a study based on GPS observations?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Have Fun,
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Brooke Clarke, N6GCE
>>>>>> http://www.PRC68.com
>>>>>> http://www.end2partygovernment.com/2012Issues.html
>>>>>> 
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>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> William H Fite, PhD
>>> Independent Consultant
>>> Statistical Analysis & Research Methods
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> 
> 
> -- 
> William H Fite, PhD
> Independent Consultant
> Statistical Analysis & Research Methods
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