[time-nuts] Super stable BVA Quartz resonators... BVA??

Richard (Rick) Karlquist richard at karlquist.com
Fri Dec 7 20:26:13 EST 2007


The 10811's specs are not in the same class with the
BVA in the first place.  At the 10811 spec level,
frequency jumps aren't that significant compared to
other frequency fluctuations, so they don't need to
be specified separately.  Phase noise and short term
stability are easily distinguished from frequency
jumps.

Didier Juges wrote:
> I looked at the HP 10811 specification and I do not see Frequency Jumps as a
> specified parameter. 
> 
> I know what it is, I have read the (very interesting) papers and postings on
> this group about it and I understand it is one of the more difficult to
> avoid and hardest to predict cause of error in crystal oscillators. Yet, it
> does not seem to be adequately covered in specifications.
> 
> Is it covered in other spec requirements such as phase noise or short term
> stability? But since these also encompass other causes, how can I tell which
> is which? If phase noise or short term stability encompasses frequency
> jumps, how can I estimate the size of frequency jumps from those
> specifications?
> 
> Didier 
> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: time-nuts-bounces at febo.com 
>> [mailto:time-nuts-bounces at febo.com] On Behalf Of Richard 
>> (Rick) Karlquist
>> Sent: Friday, December 07, 2007 5:52 PM
>> To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
>> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Super stable BVA Quartz resonators... BVA??
>>
>> Having low aging is nice, but the real problem is frequency 
>> jumps.  Do we know that they are the best in that respect?  
>> If a crystal can jump 1E-10, then that represents 10 days of 
>> aging all at once.
>>
>> Rick Karlquist, N6RK
>>
>> Didier Juges wrote:
>>> I am not aware of other crystal oscillators with better 
>> performance, 
>>> so either I am missing something (the more likely explanation) or 
>>> there is something to it.
>>>
>>> Maybe the cut is simply a smoke screen and the outstanding 
>> performance 
>>> is actually due to other process detail(s) not disclosed?
>>>
>>> Or maybe their oscillators are not that good, they just blow smoke 
>>> really well.
>>>
>>> Didier KO4BB
>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: time-nuts-bounces at febo.com
>>>> [mailto:time-nuts-bounces at febo.com] On Behalf Of Richard
>>>> (Rick) Karlquist
>>>> Sent: Friday, December 07, 2007 10:45 AM
>>>> To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
>>>> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Super stable BVA Quartz 
>> resonators... BVA??
>>>> Reminds me of the "SC" cut crystal.
>>>> It either means "Stress Compensated" or "Santa Clara", 
>> where it was 
>>>> discovered :-)
>>>>
>>>> The BVA has been around for a long time and you would 
>> think that if 
>>>> there was really something to it, everybody would be 
>> making them.  Of 
>>>> course, they are very difficult to make.
>>>>
>>>> Rick Karlquist N6RK
>>>
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> 
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